What is the maximum glide ratio for a wingsuit these days?

Back in 2010, 3:1 was huge. What is it now? Have advancements in design and development pushed the abilities to get beyond 4:1, maybe even 5:1? Has anyone gotten some solid data on the glide ratio for the new Squirrel Glider? 

The new suits are incredible, but the performance asymptote is being reached. Average G/R is still in that low 3 range, for average glide. It likely always will be because the human wingspan is fixed to its height.

Remember a wingsuit is nothing more than a really shitty glider, almost no aircraft have as poor of a glide ratio as a wingsuit.

The real performance gains have been in the flares though, 2-300 feet of altitude gained. 

If you want to see the numbers behind it, Skyderby is the place to be: 

https://skyderby.ru/virtual_competitions/2/year/2022

Good reply Roland and thanks for the  Skyderby linky, but to quote "Maverick" in the new Top Gun movie, "it all depends on the pilot in the box (suit)".

29 minutes ago, kleggo said:

Good reply Roland and thanks for the  Skyderby linky, but to quote "Maverick" in the new Top Gun movie, "it all depends on the pilot in the box (suit)".

Very true, and not just by ability-my lead sled butt will never be able to stay up with those 6'3" 170lb'ers. I can only wave as I drop away lol.

On 9/9/2022 at 3:10 AM, alfonso904 said:

Back in 2010, 3:1 was huge. What is it now? Have advancements in design and development pushed the abilities to get beyond 4:1, maybe even 5:1? Has anyone gotten some solid data on the glide ratio for the new Squirrel Glider? 

There hasn't been any measurable advance in sustained glide for quite a few years now. It topped out at 3 point something low, limited by our pathetic body aspect ratio. In the last 5 years there may have been 0.1 improvement, if that. 

Open Skyderby, filter by suit and see for yourself. 

Glider is designed for the fastest starts possible, and it glides very well - but that only means at the same sustained L/D as Jedei3 made 5 years ago. If you want even better sustained glide, the only option will be CR+, and the difference between them is tiny, roughly in 0.1 range.

The only available route to increase L/D is to increase the aspect ratio, i.e. to increase the wingspan beyond the usual wrist as a wing tip. See Antoine Laporte's prototype suit as a step in that direction - he's currently flying better than anything else on the market in BASE environment, with better starts, and with L/D that exceeds all other production BASE suits and roughly matches CR+ on longer flights.

Here’s what a long WS BASE flight looks like.

7 hours ago, BMAC615 said:

Here’s what a long WS BASE flight looks like.

Yes, this flight has been done in Jedei3 a few years ago, then in Antoine's prototype, and now in Aura5.

Looking at flight profiles for Pordoi, it could also be comfortably done in Corvids, Glider and of course CR+. 

Have a go on https://next.skyderby.ru/flight_profiles , filter by place/suit/pilot etc as you see fit.

12 hours ago, BMAC615 said:

Here’s what a long WS BASE flight looks like.

Thanks.

What a beautiful day.

Impressively fast start from my perspective.

What viddy technology allows both front facing and POV?

Thanks

Craig

4 hours ago, outrager said:

Yes, this flight has been done in Jedei3 a few years ago, then in Antoine's prototype, and now in Aura5.

Looking at flight profiles for Pordoi, it could also be comfortably done in Corvids, Glider and of course CR+. 

Have a go on https://next.skyderby.ru/flight_profiles , filter by place/suit/pilot etc as you see fit.

Yep, I’m familiar :)

Just now, kleggo said:

Thanks.

What a beautiful day.

Impressively fast start from my perspective.

What viddy technology allows bot front face and POV?

Thanks

Craig

 

 

I think Dan’s flying a GoPro 360. I fly an Insta 360 X2 that has same capabilities.

Though there are many examples of flying sustained over 3.0 glide, its in 100% of the cases residual energy from a dive and/or tailwind, or (BASE) having the right conditions with high lift and/or a tailwind.

Ive done a few flights where the glide got pushed up to a comfortable 4.5, but if you where to take the winds/thermals out, that would still only end up around 3.0 sustained.

On 9/28/2022 at 4:54 PM, BMAC615 said:

Yep, I’m familiar :)

Oops! We've indeed missed a longer version, Dom flying his Corvid2:

On 10/5/2022 at 1:53 AM, mccordia said:

Though there are many examples of flying sustained over 3.0 glide, its in 100% of the cases residual energy from a dive and/or tailwind, or (BASE) having the right conditions with high lift and/or a tailwind.

Ive done a few flights where the glide got pushed up to a comfortable 4.5, but if you where to take the winds/thermals out, that would still only end up around 3.0 sustained.

4.5 is about the same as the Space Shuttle on final approach (which was said to "glide like a brick") and only marginally better than a helicopter with engine failure.

Then there's the 2005 flight that maintained level flight-with a little help lol!                                    

On 10/12/2022 at 8:13 PM, outrager said:

Oops! We've indeed missed a longer version, Dom flying his Corvid2:

I love it. It is my dream to fly like this. I hope it will come true one day :(

Currently, the best sustained glide is around 3.5 +- 0.5 for Squirrel CR+ (performance wingsuit), depending on the pilot's experience, technique, and performance enhancing suit modifications :) Anything above that is either unsustainable (e.g., flare) or due to atmospheric effects (tail wind, thermals, etc.)

On 10/26/2022 at 4:43 PM, galda said:

Currently, the best sustained glide is around 3.5 +- 0.5 for Squirrel CR+ (performance wingsuit), depending on the pilot's experience, technique, and performance enhancing suit modifications :) Anything above that is either unsustainable (e.g., flare) or due to atmospheric effects (tail wind, thermals, etc.)

Do you think the Squirrel Glider has a better glide ratio than the CR+?

On 9/9/2022 at 10:49 AM, RolandForbes said:

The new suits are incredible, but the performance asymptote is being reached. Average G/R is still in that low 3 range, for average glide. It likely always will be because the human wingspan is fixed to its height.

This actually brings up a fascinating point.  The human wingspan is 'fixed' to a degree - this is true - but within a range that fluctuates from person to person. 

You can look up concepts like 'wingspan' or 'armspan' and their effects on many different sports.  I wonder if wingsuiting is the same.  Does anyone know if we've quantified the effects?  If we look at some of the best wingsuit pilots in the world for example, do they have abnormally long arms?  Are they abnormally tall?  

In a few sports there is talk about the 'ape index' (ratio of wingspan/armspan to height) playing an important role in performance.  I really wonder if that could be the same here.

The sport is probably not big enough to be able to tease out data at this level of detail. The best wingsuiters are the ones that wingsuit the most. 

8 hours ago, DonnellyB said:

This actually brings up a fascinating point.  The human wingspan is 'fixed' to a degree - this is true - but within a range that fluctuates from person to person. 

You can look up concepts like 'wingspan' or 'armspan' and their effects on many different sports.  I wonder if wingsuiting is the same.  Does anyone know if we've quantified the effects?  If we look at some of the best wingsuit pilots in the world for example, do they have abnormally long arms?  Are they abnormally tall?  

In a few sports there is talk about the 'ape index' (ratio of wingspan/armspan to height) playing an important role in performance.  I really wonder if that could be the same here.

Yes certainly. Its no coincidence that most national level wingsuit performance comps are won by guys who are tall and lean. 

Same reason being tall as a TI is the shit. Taller TIs have more surface area to fly their students, thus making it a bit easier to maintain stability in tandem freefall

5 hours ago, RolandForbes said:

Yes certainly. Its no coincidence that most national level wingsuit performance comps are won by guys who are tall and lean. 

Same reason being tall as a TI is the shit. Taller TIs have more surface area to fly their students, thus making it a bit easier to maintain stability in tandem freefall

What do you think is the difference in speed and glide between someone who is 5'7" and say, 6'6" 

Makes me wonder what kind of performance we would see if one of those 7 foot tall giants decided to get into wingsuiting lol. 

11 hours ago, alfonso904 said:

What do you think is the difference in speed and glide between someone who is 5'7" and say, 6'6" 

Glide is a variable thats (mostly) independent of wing size, so theoretically a 5'7 pilot will have the same average glide a 6'6 pilot (because arm size is fixed to height). 

What gives the taller pilot more range is the fact that they have more mass, and more mass means faster freefall. With this in mind: 

Airspeed * 2 == availableLift * 4 

^ double your airspeed, quadruple your lift

The heavier pilot will be able to take their suit faster than a light pilot, thus resulting in much more available lift, higher max speed, bigger potential flares, etc.

So moral of the story is, if you're short and wanna out fly your buddies, just put some sand bags in your legwing!

"Squirrel" makes the CR+... 

I just chatted with the current world champion WS pilot in performance category.

I may be wrong but he is ~ 5'10 and 165 pounds????

definitely not abnormally tall or apey no matter what the actual values are

@kleggo very interesting. I'd argue any single race is too small of an N to reliably reference for normalized data.

Would be interested to know the body size/experience level of him vs his competitors.

Interesting point though for sure