Cloudseeder

Quote ...the Truth is always the Truth. (don't you think this is a bit heavy for a skydiving forum, even for you? ) I believe this to be a Universal Truth. It is not subject to spin or editing or censure. Your Mumbo-Jumbo aside, Alan spoke the Truth in that you all at times appear to be hypocritical, and then his statements were censored. Have fun in your lollipop and lemon drop "dream land". Be thankful that you have little guys like Chuck to look out for you in your fantasy world. Interesting that not one of the chumps who thought they had a go at me had any positive input as to how we should change USPA. Fair Winds and Unlimited Ceilings, Don L. "Treetop" Jardine

[ Quote The fact that Alans' statements of Truth have been censured here should prove that this forum has no *real* worth. That is true, Sangiro. Opinions do vary,however, facts don't change and the Truth is always the Truth. "Treetop"

I found it to become even more interesting after Alan called the group on their own hypocrisy. The fact that Alans' statements of Truth have been censured here should prove that this forum has no *real* worth. Live in your fantasy land. Gingerbread and Sunshine and never is heard a disparaging word. I envy you your naivete. Fair Winds and Unlimited Ceilings, "Treetop"

Mr. Von, Your statements above might indicate to others that not only are you a USPA Rah-Rah type, but also that you may be a non-thinking , non-truth seeking ,"jack-ass". Fair Winds, "Treetop"

Yo' Mr. Happy, I'm not hindering any investigation. I 'm suprised that you have never educated yourself as to how to access the BOD minutes! Here's a hint. Go to www.uspa.org , scroll down on the right to BOD, when that page opens click on board minutes. I hope that helps. "Treetop"

QuoteLet me see if I understand our point of view correctly, because I think you -may- have actually changed my mind a bit on this one. What you're saying is that by holding an AFF cert course at your non-GM DZ it doesn't take any business away from a GM DZ. If that is, in fact, the case, then I agree with you. It should probably be allowed without any further cost. Mr Quade , If you'll refer to the Summer 2000 BOD minutes you'll see that the BOD had declared that non-GM DZs could hold a course but that GM DZs would have a priority in holding courses. At the Winter 2001 BOD meeting that was changed to any non GM DZ would pay a fee equal to , bla blka blao, basically the highest GM fee ($400) I don't remember the exact fee at the time. For every course held!!!! At this point it's if a non member Dz had two courses they'd pay twice as much as the highest GM fee. If they held three they'd pay triple the normal GM fee. I , yes yours truly, attended the summer 2001 meting and negotiated a temporary compromise. A stop gap measure ,if you will. If you 'll reference those meeting minutes you will see that compromise as a passed motion. "Treetop"

All the legislative effort USPA puts forth, and development of the instructional programs, costs money. USPA can pass 100 percent of that cost along to you and I as individual members, or they can charge a percentage to us, and a percentage to the profit making dropzones that also derive a benefit. I like the idea of profitable dropzones footing part of the bill for USPA services. I think they should pay for those services out of their business income Mr Buchanan, Who do you think pays the current GMDZO dues? It is the customer . When a business looks at their business plan for the upcoming year they look at planned expenses and expected revenues. They take this data and determine how much planned profit they will realize. They then adjust their retail prices to ensure that they will make at least the expected profit. If there is an expected expense of $400 for the GM program that money isn't coming out of the end year bottom line. That $400 is is coming out of the customers pockets , pennies at a time. The Myth of the GM program is that GMs pay any dues. The fact is that GMs only *collect* dues and pass it on to USPA. "Treetop"

Its really pathetic that people would not send back their proxy last year so some of these election problems could be eliiminated. Unfortunately there aren't enough skydivers out there that care. No Judy, What's really pathetic is that 8 months later you still don't realize that USPA could not allow proxy voting at the Feb BOD meeting. What's really pathetic is that the BOD voted to spend over $7000 on a solicitation of worthless proxies. What's most pathetic is the very real fact that when Our Executive Directr realized the fact that their was no provision in Our By-Laws for proxy voting he attempted to slide in wording which would allow it. LOFL ! The most pathetic is the fact that the ammendment he illegaly added to our By-Laws ..LOL!(excuse me.. ROTFLMOL!!!!!!) The illegal ammendment that Chris Needels added to Our By-Laws to allow voting by proxy... Didn't! ROTFLMOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! $7000 of proxies , To catch the Executive Director of USPA Illegaly ammending Our by-Laws, Priceless! "Treetop"

QuoteHe is complaining because they fixed his punctuation and capitalization. __________________________________________________ No Judy, I'm seeking an injunction because even after being alerted to their mistake USPA refuses to present my statement to the Membership. __________________________________________________ Now he wants to sue the USPA because of it. It sounds like a good waste of my money. Thanks Don! __________________________________________________ Thank the Executive Director. If you had read my letter to him in its entirety you would realize that I stated that I hoped we could "reason together" and that I would prefer that this matter didn't cost the Membership. Chris is the one who wanted to play *hard ball*. First they violate the Rules and you guys want to jump me! I gave them an out . They refuse however ,to release to you my statement. I'd be wondering why!!! Is it what I said or how I said it? Why is USPA willing to expend untold dollars in order to censure me in violation of Our rules?? Yes, something is very wrong here. It ain't me. "Treetop'

I know that you don't have any respect for me; you made that pretty obvious with your attitude when I met you at Rantoul. ________________________________________________ Really? Would you explain that statement? __________________________________________________ I perused the USPA Governance Manual and found section 3-1.2.D.2 on page 40. "If appropriate, minimal editing of the biographical sketches by the committee is authorized to comform to the space available and to provide some uniformity of verbiage and presentation." (italics mine) This section seems to allow editing for reasons of grammar and punctuation, which, if read carefully, section 3-1.2.D.3.e also seems to allow for. __________________________________________________ Ok I think by now it is obvious that that paragraph does not apply to the candidates' "personal statements". Will you admit that you were a little too fast on the draw here Lisa? Will you admit that in your attempt to prove me wrong you never took the time to consider that I just might be right? __________________________________________________ I find it very hard to believe that someone who is "for the fun jumpers" would stoop to causing the association he wishes to be on the board of to spend the fun jumpers money (USPA dues) on defending said organization from a frivilous lawsuit. __________________________________________________ There is nothing "frivolous" about this lawsuit Lisa! USPA has a history of violating Our Rules Of Governance". Violation of Our Election Rules is the most grevious Governance Violation which could be imposed on any organization! To accuse me of forcing the jumpers to spend their money is akin to accusing a rape victim of costing the citizens the court costs to plead their case. Why hasn't USPA simply changed my statement on the website? Why didn't they follow Our Rules originally? Why are they willing to spend your money to hide my statement in violation of Our rules?? Why did Larry Bagley lie to Bill Von about some Governance Manual requirement that all publications be checked for spelling and capitalization? People are saying "He won't post his statement". As previously stated on this thread my attorney has requested that I not divulge particulars. The fact is that Chris Needels has the original anyway. If you would like to view the original statement as submited, contact [email protected] __________________________________________________ Personal attacks and attacks on groups of people are the last resort of someone who has exhausted their argument. It's either attack us or repeat the same tired statements. __________________________________________________ See and here you are somewhat off base. Now I don't know where you were raised but I was all in the street. If I find myself against one or two people I just take 'em on straight. When eight or twenty or a hundred are against me I put my back to a wall and lash out at all of them. I go wild dog crazy mad. __________________________________________________ It's the people who AREN'T posting in this thread and participating in your "most excellent entertainment" you should be thinking about... those who are reading but not commenting on your "arguments" and your refusal to post the one thing that would prove your point once and for all. __________________________________________________ That doesn't concern me. They'll think what they will. I'm not out to persuade anyone. I just tell it like it is.Obviously "It" (USPA) is a hotbed of corruption. If the Members can't see that after all I've exposed, then that's not my problem. They'll get what their own efforts have afforded them. __________________________________________________ btw, even sadder when said person has been asked by one of the people who was involved in the situation to stop bringing it up. __________________________________________________ I'll pm you on that if I can figure out how! Fair Winds, "Treetop"

Stick your head out the door Dave The meteor showers tonight are spectacular!

Please scroll up and reread one of my earlier posts in which I addressed this specifically. __________________________________________________ Nope, cant find that! Of course I limited my search to "logical arguments" ________________________________________________ Oh, and I think the moderators "clocked out" because it is nearly 4am. DZ.dot com types for sure! I'm not sleeping tonight Sir,how about you?

And that is great for people like you who are unwilling to reseach the facts I bet. People like you who talk alot without any facts. So Aggie Dave, Have you looked yet at Our Governance Manual? What does it say about National Director Candidates' statements? Sir? "Treetop"

QuoteYou are trying to persuade me to believe in your arguement, thus it is your responsibility to provide facts to prove your statements, not mine. _________________________________________________ It may be that way in a court situation Aggie Dave but it's not quite like that in a membership association. Different rules don't ch'a know, So have you even gotten off your wide ass to look up Our Governance manual and verify the facts I've provided concerning Section 3-1.2.D.3.d. or have you been too busy talkin' some bullshittin' fake ass sir ? Are you really such an uninformed punk in real life? Look Dave, It's all right there. I led you to the ring. Now read it and stand up. The greenies aren't going to help you out here because they've already read and figured out that I'm right on. Now it's time for you to educate yourself Dave. Then you can talk as an educated man. "Treetop"