Do military static line jumps count toward jump numbers or just mil. freefall jumps?

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Also, anyone who has been through jump school could teach a PLF or emergency procedures better than any AFF instructor, PERIOD!

You obviously have not seen or jumped with any recent graduates of the BAC

Eh, they said the same thing about us when we graduated and I would guess we have a 20 year separation (or there about) in class dates.

BAC Grads land like "crap", most round jumpers tend to land like "crap". It is a small part of the bigger Job, and they do what they need to walk away with out injury so they can do their mission, but you know that and I am not teaching you any thing new of course.

"We" do this Skydiving thing (Mostly) because it is a fun and exciting Hobby and we want to keep doing it so we learn to land better.

Matt

I logged my military jumps... But I already had 1500 jumps so I didn't care about the license stuff.

Now, I don't personally think a guy with 20 military S/L's and 7 AFF's should be qualified to get an "A" license.... But a guy with 1000 jumps logging those 20 S/L's do not seem to be a big deal.

Clear as mud?

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I logged my military jumps... But I already had 1500 jumps so I didn't care about the license stuff.

Now, I don't personally think a guy with 20 military S/L's and 7 AFF's should be qualified to get an "A" license.... But a guy with 1000 jumps logging those 20 S/L's do not seem to be a big deal.

Clear as mud?

A more realistic question would be can someone with 150 freefalls and and 50 military static lines get their C?

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I logged my military jumps... But I already had 1500 jumps so I didn't care about the license stuff.

Now, I don't personally think a guy with 20 military S/L's and 7 AFF's should be qualified to get an "A" license.... But a guy with 1000 jumps logging those 20 S/L's do not seem to be a big deal.

Clear as mud?

A more realistic question would be can someone with 150 freefalls and and 50 military static lines get their C?

I vote No. With the exception of SL-progression/RAPS- style S/L jumps (if any) as the beginning part of a military freefall training program, combat-style military S/L jumps should not count toward skydiving licenses or ratings.

That being said, they are valid times a person has jumped from an aircraft in flight for the purpose of having his life saved by a parachute, and then landing under that parachute; and that experience certainly has its own value (confidence; situational awareness; shit-together-ness, etc.). So I'd look at your 150/50 guy and say, "There's a guy with 200 lifetime jumps; now he only needs another 50 freefall jumps to qualify for his C."

(It does seem logical to count military freefall jumps toward licenses and ratings, though.)

I could have sworn i recently got an email from USPA regarding logging of military jumps. It may have been a USPA professional email that spoke about logging military jumps and that verification by an S&TA or appropriate person allows them to be logged.

I cannot find it though... Did anyone else remember seeing that recently?

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A more realistic question would be can someone with 150 freefalls and and 50 military static lines get their C?

I would say no.

I would count them for awards, but not licenses.

In Britain al parachuting is conducted in line with BPA guide lines (with exception to exiting altitude) but how can you compare a person jumping an LLP/T10 round parachute in the same terms as a man who jumps a S/L Square canopy? I have a few jumps on round canopy's and in no way IN MY OPINION is it the same as a S/L Square jump, where you have to physically steer the canopy as opposed to drifting with the wind.
S/L rounds - NO
S/L Squares - Yes
Besides you cant swoop T10's.......yet

Interestingly, I had a young man come to us yesterday who'd completed the HALO course in San Diego last year and had a proficiency card signed off with an A-license stamp, yet none of the blocks (date, initials, license #) on the pro-card had anything but a stamped star in them. (the pro-card was xeroxed onto legal-sized paper, and in the extra space there was a block explaining that the stars represented that he'd met all the requirements but had not been thru a hand-deploy transition..)

He'd neglected to send in his proficiency card to USPA when he got it, so he techncially wasn't an A-licensed jumper. He had 26 jumps in his log book, all freefalls, and did not have his 5 military static-line jumps from BAS in there. (I had to laugh when I'm reading his logbook entries and out of 26 jumps he's got like 5 night jumps...)

We went thru and using his logbook we re-transcribed all the entries with legit dates onto a new card and I starred those items which were based on his course qualification and wrote "Transcribed from logbook entries and previous proficiency card" and told him "When you mail this to USPA, send a copy of your new card, and a copy of that old one, too.." I then took him on an recurrency/check-dive and signed off his A for a 2nd time :) (Honestly, he was a good skydiver, did a nice job, highly altitude aware, good tracking skills, paid attention to the transition training, nice freefall skills...)

I asked him about his S/L jumps at Benning, and he said "As far as I'm concerned, they don't count. That was nothing like sport jumping..."

So, you know, he's got that going. I mean, after all, its 5 jumps...

NIN
D-19617, AFF-I '19

Did we not used to skydive round parachutes? I'm sure when we did skydive those people did hop n' pops too which are not far off from Static Line jumps conducted today, and I think they were damn near the same chutes.(T-10 reserve, etc) I like that the BPA ops manual answers this straight-forward that Military Static lines with round chutes does not count. It seems like for the USPA its up to interpretation and I am now as confused as I was when I first asked this question.

A PROPERLY signed and filled out A Lic. Prof card IS the License. No need to send it to USPA till you have enough for a B unless your just wanting the membership card to reflect the license too.

Matt

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S/L rounds - NO
S/L Squares - Yes

So, would you deduct all round freefall jumps made by the old timers from their logbooks?

Walk up to Jerry Bird and tell him he now only has X number because his round jumps do not count?

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In Britain al parachuting is conducted in line with BPA guide lines (with exception to exiting altitude) but how can you compare a person jumping an LLP/T10 round parachute in the same terms as a man who jumps a S/L Square canopy? I have a few jumps on round canopy's and in no way IN MY OPINION is it the same as a S/L Square jump, where you have to physically steer the canopy as opposed to drifting with the wind.
S/L rounds - NO
S/L Squares - Yes
Besides you cant swoop T10's.......yet

No swooping on T-10s but you can on an MC1-1D or an SF-10A

And you can do more than just drift with the wind on a -1 or sf-10, just ask these guys.


http://www.ng.mil/news/archives/2008/08/081108-Leapfest.aspx

Those two forget some thing?

"Look Before You Turn"

"Turn In The Opposite Direction To Avoid Fellow Jumpers"
("Formally Turn Right To Avoid Collisions")

"The Lower Jumper Has the Right Of Way"

Matt

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In Britain al parachuting is conducted in line with BPA guide lines (with exception to exiting altitude) but how can you compare a person jumping an LLP/T10 round parachute in the same terms as a man who jumps a S/L Square canopy? I have a few jumps on round canopy's and in no way IN MY OPINION is it the same as a S/L Square jump, where you have to physically steer the canopy as opposed to drifting with the wind.
S/L rounds - NO
S/L Squares - Yes
Besides you cant swoop T10's.......yet

No swooping on T-10s but you can on an MC1-1D or an SF-10A

And you can do more than just drift with the wind on a -1 or sf-10, just ask these guys.


http://www.ng.mil/news/archives/2008/08/081108-Leapfest.aspx

Speaking of yourself in the 3rd person?

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An active Army team from Fort Campbell, Ky., won the championship. Four paratroopers from Headquarters and Headquarters Company, 1st Battalion, 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment, became the first active Army team to capture the Leapfest crown since 1999. Team members were Sergeants Justin Rondorf and Jeffrey Inman and Specialists Daniel Almodovar and Justin Rondorf tied two other jumpers for the day’s fastest combined individual time of 21 seconds.

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Did we not used to skydive round parachutes? I'm sure when we did skydive those people did hop n' pops too which are not far off from Static Line jumps conducted today, and I think they were damn near the same chutes.(T-10 reserve, etc) I like that the BPA ops manual answers this straight-forward that Military Static lines with round chutes does not count. It seems like for the USPA its up to interpretation and I am now as confused as I was when I first asked this question.

The reason why skydiving round-canopy S/L jumps did/do count toward skydiving ratings/licenses, while military (i.e., combat-style) round S/L jumps do not, is because the skydiving S/L jumps are in training for freefall: arch, count, reach, pull; and thus they help train and reinforce skydiving training and procedures. Even more so when the EPs are the "cutaway" version, not the military "keep the main, toss out the reserve" version (I was trained on both - different DZs while I was a student in the 70s). Not so for combat-style military S/L jumps, which train and reinforce a different, even if partially overlapping, skill-set. Being a grey area, it's a reasonable place to draw the line.

Understandable but while jumping rounds in the military has not taught me free fall skills it has taught me a lot about being aware while under canopy.

Well Robert I did not want to sound to cocky...

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Those two forget some thing?

"Look Before You Turn"

"Turn In The Opposite Direction To Avoid Fellow Jumpers"
("Formally Turn Right To Avoid Collisions")

"The Lower Jumper Has the Right Of Way"

Matt

Target fixation. That year some guys didnt even realize they got blown off the wind line and landed on a sun tent

Im still trying to figure out why the article says that they popped the reserves after an entanglement... I was just there a few months ago and they said one canopy can handle 2 fully loaded jumpers. I see the lower canopy is deformed, but the higher isnt, yet both popped reserves?

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Im still trying to figure out why the article says that they popped the reserves after an entanglement... I was just there a few months ago and they said one canopy can handle 2 fully loaded jumpers. I see the lower canopy is deformed, but the higher isnt, yet both popped reserves?

You were jumping T-10s. Just by looking at that picture you cant tell but we were jumping MC1-1D canopies and that means both jumpers will stay where they are, and activate their reserves using the pull drop method.

Why shouldn't they count?

How many people are willing to do this shit?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZqfN_XzKg4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90oZzL3ET78

I was on this jump
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFk6BmHEROE&feature=related

As far as I am concerned to the poster about 100/50 should they be able to jump with a GoPro or Contour...absolutely! Airborne carry much more equipment and are more prone to snags than any skydiver and are probably more altitude aware and conscious about their equipment!

And yes I am biased, I have 2 combat jumps and know how to think outside the box!

and to another poster it is not far off to have an airborne student with 26 jumps and already have 5 night jumps! 90% of military jumps are done in the night, not sure if you were making fun but it is absolutely plausible!

But on the other hand, If a skydiver came to Ft. Benning for Airborne school their qualifications would be nothing but laughed at, Face it you are just another leg and probably don't have what it really takes to truly be AIRBORNE!


It's been a couple of years and i didn't think I would miss being treated like cargo, but I sure miss it and would do another in a heart beat!

So do they count or not… ? 
 

I am an MFFI, Static liner, sport skydiver, demos, HALOs etc.. please enlighten)) @riggerrob

15 hours ago, randhawa922 said:

So do they count or not… ? 

You've replied to a 14 year old thread. How to qualify for ratings and awards is available in .pdf format:

https://www.uspa.org/rating-holders-and-s-tas/sim-irm

On 5/31/2024 at 2:57 AM, randhawa922 said:

So do they count or not… ? 

yes, they count, if you have the signed 1306.

36 minutes ago, sfzombie13 said:

yes, they count,

Not in all cases - hence the .pdf format as the source for answering the question properly.